Normandy Revisited (AAR #2)

Discussion relating to Battles in Normandy

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Postby Robjess » Sat Aug 14, 2004 6:25 pm

Rogers salient to the west of Caen is causes me major problems! Last turn he managed to break through my lines and took out some of my ART units.. not good.

This turn has seen me pulling my line right back to try and contain him.. Although you will notice that I was unable to get two units back as far as I would have liked.. and are now quite vulnerable.. I expect them to come under heavy fire from Roger next turn.

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The above image shows all of the British sector.. you can also see that I have had to pull back around Villers Bocage as I shortened my line there so I could redirect some units further east..

There is a real risk that Caen may end up in a pocket - as you can see.. which is what Roger is hopeful of.. and just alook at all of that Allied Interdiction.. and yes, it hurts.

Looking at the US sector..

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I have also pulled back quite a bit as Roger's attacks start to weaken my line.. I expect Roger to exploit to the East of St Lo and maybe to its West also.. in an attempt to pocket it. Having said that he will probably conduct a direct assault on the town and force a retreat :)

But it wasnt all doom and gloom this turn. I am still conducting assaults out of Caen.. the first one saw some Brits go scurrying (they got off lightly damage wise but were smart enough to retreat) away from the bridges to the north of the City.

And to the West of the city I saw some major success..

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This assault saw Roger take 5 step losses! This again shows you how difficult it is to assault Caen. The town is surrounded by clear terrain and getting too close invites counter attacks from a strong German opponent. This is why Roger is seeking to come around from the South West..

All up, this is what the battlefield looks like..

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Postby Roger Keating » Sat Aug 14, 2004 8:46 pm

For those of you who think I might be overly cautious around Caen the last turn indicates what can happen to an adventurous Allied player. In test games German forces have sweep the British forces back to Omaha. It is wise for the British player to take it cautiously, and I have put detachments in front of my line to help a bit.

Last turn the British could have attacked Caen at 6-1, which was the best odds Rob left me. I decided that it was simply not worth the effort and continued on my push through the Bocage to the South, a much safer route.

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On the other front St Lo has fallen. The first attack at 10-1 failed but the second succeeded.

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It will be interesting to see who works out how to get 2nd and 3rd armor over to the Caen area to assault the town. The British has some very nice units but lack the real punch power of the US forces.
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Postby Wotan » Sat Aug 14, 2004 9:00 pm

WHy do some of the allied units have a German cross on their unit emblem?
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Postby Robjess » Sat Aug 14, 2004 9:26 pm

Did we cover that earlier on in this thread? The German cross indicated a minor objective in that hex. It just happens to look like its on the allied unit, but its actually on the hex not the unit.
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Postby Scona » Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:06 am

In the case of US units like the 2 or 3 armoured being used around Caen, what penalties are suffered for combined attacks mounted by units using supplies from a different national hq; and do stacks of composed of different allied units fight as well as "pure" stacks?
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Postby hank » Sun Aug 15, 2004 4:11 am

only after playing TAO many months ago to the bitter end, did I find out I couldn't combint brits and ameris together in an assault. Unless I was just way in left field this is what I remember happening and thought it was a bug ... was I imagining that one??

... I used to play left field so maybe I was out there when that game was going on ... muyahahah

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Postby panzmatt » Sun Aug 15, 2004 6:27 am

you where, are?, correct. Bin probably will do similar
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Postby Roger Keating » Sun Aug 15, 2004 8:26 am

Like KP, different countries in BIN can't use other countries supply sources or combine in any way. This means no combined attacks and can't even occupy the same hex. Using two countries in a close assault is difficult as retreat paths are often blocked and artillery support can't be shared.
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Postby Robjess » Sun Aug 15, 2004 9:54 am

Not one single assault this turn. I had enough on my hands in terms of trying to cover the holes which Roger had created then have to worry about attacking.

The biggest threat of course if to the South West of Caen.. and I havent been as successful in covering his move here as I had hoped. I expect a lot more trouble next turn.. but with a bit of luck Roger may find that he extends too far and gives me a good opportunity for a counter attack.

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The problem is though that apart from the breach - I have also had to weaken my assets in Caen itself... whilst now not only limits my control of the area and my ability to launch attacks out of there - but also causes me some concern that Roger may be able to assault Caen directly now.


St Lo has fallen - whilst this has made Hitler very unhappy, the good news is that it enables me to fall back..

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So I have therefore chose to start to pull back - dropping detachments as I go (where possible) to deny Roger tactical shifts in any combat he conducts as he follows me. As you can see though that around Caen I again am faced with the problem that some of my units are pinned down and are unable to keep up.. this makes they targets for Roger in his next turn.
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Postby Roger Keating » Sun Aug 15, 2004 10:21 am

Not a lot to report this turn. Around Caen the advance to the South is proceeding well and the German forces moving South out of Caen make the British life a lot easier. Those counter attacks can be devastating. I have now moved up to change the control in the hexes around Caen so that I can plan an assault. This turn a 6-1 was the best I could do so waiting, again, seemed the best strategy.

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I have exposed a few units but it is necessary to keep the pressure up. To attack, the Germans will have to concentrate forces and, hopefully, that is not one their options.

I have moved a pontoon unit up to the river line to provide a temporary bridge that will help supply and movement. Another pontoon unit is in position to make an incursion across the second river a possibility.

In the St Lo sector bad dice and bad terrain have combined to make any real progress impossible this turn.
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Postby Robjess » Sun Aug 15, 2004 10:37 am

Upon loading me turn I was faced with some serious supply issues:

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The problem here - apart from Allied interdiction further back hehind my lines, is that there is no road leading up to my frontline which supplies can travel through...

Infact you can see that I had resorted to placing one of my supply units off the road to try and get some suppies to my men.. I have paid the price as a result of that choice as there are now no supplies able to get to that supply truck for it to distribute! It doesnt matter how close your supply truck is to your men is there is nothing to hand around.

As a result of this I have really pulled my line back now..

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I would have preferred to get it a bit straighter then it is.. but I couldnt retreat as far back in some parts as I would have liked.

Things look bad also around the Caen breakout.. as Roger's interdiction plays havoc with me there also. Where the terrain and rivers are you friend in terms of providing some good defensive lines - it can also work against you in cutting the supply to your own units at times.

So I have had no choice but to pull back slighly to try and get my units into a supplied zone.. this has presented its own problems as I again find that I have units that are unable to keep up. This time its quite a stong ARM unit.. which were unable to regain supplies and refit whilst it was sitting in the frontline.. so its had to be left behind.

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These new refit rules add a whole new dimension to the game.. and its particularly felt in the Ardennes scenario where the German player can no longer continue to advance using extended movement.

There is still some fun to be had by my strong ARM around Caen though. Last turn I set a bit of a trap, I vacated a clear hex which was bound by four hexes of my units. Roger took my bait and advanced into the hex (destroying a strong point which I had placed in the hex - so it looked like I as trying to defend it).

I then conducted a counter attack.. now I must admit I got a lot of luck here with my assault.. resulting in 6 lost steps to Mr Keating (I took minor loses (2 steps).

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At the end of it all, this is the situation around Caen.. the pointy end of Rogers salient to the south west of Caen is still where I am weakest. But my line running up north south along the river to Caen is something which causes me concern. Behind my line are open fields of grass which arent going to be much fun to defend in if Roger gets over that river..

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Postby Roger Keating » Sun Aug 15, 2004 3:23 pm

This is the CA view of the Caen sector. Maximum odds of 8-1 against two Caen city hexes with few other opportunities to improve things in the main urban areas.

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The push down South is proceeding well although the ability of the German units to mount a counter attack have been shown last turn.

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The air interdiction, rather than obvious combat successes, have made the German line retreat. It is just very difficult to keep the front line supplied. I have moved another volunteer unit into the clear hex to the South of the city as I need to keep as much pressure as possible in this sector.

The US sector has again launched numerous attacks and has accounted for more enemy steps but no KIA's. The German line falls back and it is difficult to organize effective multiple attacks. Even when a hole was created in the line and an exposed supply truck was sitting behind it there were no units that could penetrate through it.

The main action for the next couple of turns is definitely going to be in the Caen sector.
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Postby panzmatt » Sun Aug 15, 2004 3:57 pm

What turn is it? out of? great aar...
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Postby Robjess » Sun Aug 15, 2004 4:31 pm

Its 28 out of 32..
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Postby Joel137 » Tue Aug 17, 2004 1:22 am

After seeing that roll of boxcars in the German attack around Caen, I think if I were Roger, I'd be insisting that Rob switch dice. :)
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